If god exists, why not show us all indisputable proof, so we can stop all this fighting?

Supposedly Jesus performed so many miracles:

- raised people form the dead

- turned water into wine

- walked on water

The diciples, if they really witnessed that, had no choice but to believe. It wasn't hard for them, they saw proof.

Those that say "We need faith in God, that's why he doesn't reveal himself" - consider then why did Jesus "perform" so many miracles?

Why doesn't god reveal itself to us now, so we could record it scientifically, retransmit the proof, and proclaim that god does exist.

If god could do that then we wouldn't need people trying to convince non believers of god.

If god doesn't exist what would you expect:

- No evidence of god,

- Many various religions saying they know god

- Unsubstantiated accounts of miracles (like Jesus)

Or, put another way: exactly what we see now.

Holy books are not proof by the way. They are just books, ripe for the flushing at http://flushaholybook.com

If god exists, why not show us all indisputable proof, so we can stop all this fighting?ballet theater

Very true.

God has more in common with a non-existent figment then an existing being.

You will probably get some bs about free-will though. For some reason god and jesus could interfere with our development and progress through out human history, but today apparently that 's a no-no.

In any case, knowing god exists does not effect freewill. You can still go off and break all the laws you want.

If god exists, why not show us all indisputable proof, so we can stop all this fighting?chicago theater opera theater

If you have faith in God you don't need any proof
What, and stop all these hilarious arguments? You're no fun.
Because they can't.
Why? you'd just find ANOTHER REASON TO try and disprove Him. You live and breathe, and are blessed to do so. deal with it.
i agree, he is after all suppose to be all powerful
That page has malware embedded in it.
Those words were said to Jesus on the cross "show us a miracle and we will believe" When you believe with your heart and confess with your mouth that Jesus is Lord, you will be saved, you will see for yourself the truth. Don't dabble or play games, come to Jesus and find out the truth.
This is the best question I have ever seen on this segment....
You want proof? How about evolution? lol........

In our everyday experience, just about everything seems to

have a beginning. In fact, the laws of science show that even

things which look the same through our lifetime, like the sun

and other stars, are running down. The sun is using up its

fuel at millions of tonnes each second. since, therefore, it

cannot last forever, it had to have a beginning. The same can

be shown to be true for the entire universe.

So when Christians claim that the God of the Bible created the

entire universe, some will ask what seems a logical question,

namely Where did God come from?

The Bible makes it clear in many places that God is outside of

time. He is eternal, with no beginning or end - He is

infinite! He also knows all things, being infinitely

intelligent.

1 Is this logical? Can modern science allow for such a notion?

how could you recognize the evidence for an intelligent

Creator?

Recognizing intelligence

For more information, visit Q%26amp;A: God Scientists get excited

about finding stone tools in a cave because these

speak of intelligence - a tool maker. They could not have

designed themselves. Neither would anyone believe that the

carved Presidents' heads on Mt Rushmore were the product of

millions of years of chance erosion. We can recognize design -

the evidence of the outworkings of intelligence - in the

man-made objects all around us.

Similarly, in William Paley's famous argument, a watch implies

a watchmaker.

2 Today, however, a large proportion of people, including many

leading scientists, believe that all plants and animals,

including the incredibly complex brains of the people who make

watches, motor cars, etc., were not designed by an intelligent

God but rather came from an unintelligent evolutionary

process. But is this a defensible position?

Design in living things

Molecular biologist Dr Michael Denton, writing as an agnostic,

concluded:

Alongside the level of ingenuity and complexity exhibited by

the molecular machinery of life, even our most advanced

[twentieth century technology appears] clumsy. It would be an

illusion to think that what we are aware of at present is any

more than a fraction of the full extent of biological design.

In practically every field of fundamental biological research

ever-increasing levels of design and complexity are being

revealed at an ever-accelerating rate.

3 The world-renowned crusader for Darwinism and atheism, Prof.

Richard Dawkins, states:

We have seen that living things are too improbable and too

beautifully designed to have come into existence by chance.

4 Thus, even the most ardent atheist concedes that design is all

around us. To a Christian, the design we see all around us is

totally consistent with the Bible's explanation that God

created all.

However, evolutionists like Dawkins reject the idea of a

Designer. He comments (emphasis added):

All appearance to the contrary, the only watchmaker in nature

is the blind forces of physics, *albeit deployed in a very

special way.* A true watchmaker has foresight: he designs his

cogs and springs, and plans their interconnections, with

future purpose in his mind's eye. [Is this not what we SEE?]

Natural selection, the blind, unconscious,

automatic process which Darwin discovered, and which we now

know is the explanation for the existence and apparently

purposeful form of all life, has no purpose in.

[Seems like a non sequitur to me...]

It has no mind. It does not

plan for the future - it is the blind watchmaker.

[Two words: Bird wings.]

5 Selection and design

Life is built on information, contained in that molecule of

heredity, DNA. Dawkins believes that natural selection6 and

mutations (blind, purposeless copying mistakes in this DNA)

together provide the mechanism for producing the vast amounts

of information responsible for the design in living things.7

[One might as well expect a Sonata to emerge from radio static.]

Natural selection is a logical process that can be observed.

However, selection can only operate on the information already

contained in genes - it does not produce new information.8

Actually, this is consistent with the Bible's account of

origins; God created distinct kinds of animals

and plants, each to reproduce after its own kind.

One can observe great variation in a kind, and see the results

of natural selection. For instance, dingoes, wolves, and

coyotes have developed over time as a result of natural

selection operating on the information in the genes of the

wolf/dog kind.

But no new information was produced - these varieties have

resulted from rearrangement, and sorting out, of the

information in the original dog kind. One kind has never been

observed to change into a totally different kind with new

information that previously did not exist!

Without a way to increase information, natural selection will

not work as a mechanism for evolution. Evolutionists agree

with this, but they believe that mutations somehow provide the

new information for natural selection to act upon.

Can mutations produce new information?

Actually, it is now clear that the answer is no! Dr Lee

Spetner, a highly qualified scientist who taught information

and communication theory at Johns Hopkins University, makes

this abundantly clear in his recent book:

In this chapter I'll bring several examples of evolution,

[i.e., instances alleged to be examples of evolution]

particularly mutations, and show that information is not

increased. But in all the reading I've done in the

life-sciences literature, I've never found a mutation that

added information.9

All point mutations that have been studied on the molecular

level turn out to reduce the genetic information and not to

increase it.10

The NDT [neo-Darwinian theory] is supposed to explain how the

information of life has been built up by evolution. The

essential biological difference between a human and a

bacterium is in the information they contain. All other

biological differences follow from that. The human genome has

much more information than does the bacterial genome.

Information cannot be built up by mutations that lose it. A

business can't make money by losing it a little at a time.11

Evolutionary scientists have no way around the conclusions

that many scientists, including Dr Spetner, have come to.

Mutations do not work as a mechanism to fuel the evolutionary

process. More problems!

Scientists have found that within the cell, there are

thousands of what can be called biochemical machines. All of

their parts have to be in place simultaneously or the cell

can't function. Things which were thought to be simple

mechanisms, such as being able to sense light and turn it into

electrical impulses, are in fact highly complicated.

Since life is built on these 'machines', the idea that natural

processes could have made a living system is untenable.

Biochemist Dr Michael Behe (see The mousetrap man) uses the

term 'irreducible complexity' in describing such biochemical

'machines'.

systems of horrendous, irreducible complexity inhabit the

cell. The resulting realization that life was designed by an

intelligence is a shock to us in the twentieth century who

have gotten used to thinking of life as the result of simple

natural laws. But other centuries have had their shocks, and

there is no reason to suppose that we should escape them.12

Richard Dawkins recognizes this problem of needing 'machinery'

to start with when he states:

"The theory of the blind watchmaker is extremely powerful

given that we are allowed to assume replication and hence

cumulative selection. But if replication needs complex

machinery, since the only way we know for complex machinery

ultimately to come into existence is cumulative selection,

we have a problem." 13

A problem indeed! The more we look into the workings of life,

the more complicated it gets, and the more we see that life

could not arise by itself. Not only is a source of information

needed, but the complex 'machines' of the chemistry of life

need to be in existence right from the start!

A greater problem still!

Some still try to insist that the machinery of the first cell

could have arisen by pure chance. For instance, they say, by

randomly drawing alphabet letters in sequence from a hat,

sometimes you will get a simple word like "BAT".14 So given

long time periods, why couldn't even more complex information

arise by chance?

However, what would the word "BAT" mean to a German or Chinese

speaker? The point is that an order of letters is meaningless

unless there is a language convention and a translation system

in place which makes it meaningful!

In a cell, there is such a system (other molecules) that makes

the order on the DNA meaningful. DNA without the

language/translation system is meaningless, and these systems

without the DNA wouldn't work either.

The other complication is that the translation machinery which

reads the order of the 'letters' in the DNA is itself

specified by the DNA! This is another one of those 'machines'

that needs to be fully-formed or life won't work.

Can information arise from non-information?

Dr Werner Gitt, Director and Professor at the German Federal

Institute of Physics and Technology, makes it clear that one

of the things we know absolutely for sure from science, is

that information cannot arise from disorder by chance. It

always takes (greater) information to produce information, and

ultimately information is the result of intelligence:

A code system is always the result of a mental process (it

requires an intelligent origin or inventor). It should be

emphasized that matter as such is unable to generate any code.

All experiences indicate that a thinking being voluntarily

exercising his own free will, cognition, and

creativity, is required.15

There is no known natural law through which matter can give

rise to information, neither is any physical process or

material phenomenon known that can do this.16

What is the source of the information?

We can therefore deduce that the huge amount of information in

living things must originally have come from an intelligence,

which had to have been far superior to ours, as scientists are

revealing every day. But then, some will say that such a

source would have to be caused by something with even greater

information/intelligence.

However, if they reason like this, one could ask where this

greater information/intelligence came from? And then where did

that one come from. One could extrapolate to infinity, for

ever, unless...

Unless there was a source of infinite intelligence, beyond our

finite understanding. But isn't this what the Bible indicates

when we read, In the beginning God...? The God of the Bible is

an infinite being not bound by limitations of time, space,

knowledge, or anything else.

So which is the logically defensible position? - that matter

eternally existed (or came into existence by itself for no

reason), and then by itself arranged itself into information

systems against everything observed in real science? Or that

a being with infinite intelligence,17 created information

systems for life to exist, agreeing with real science?

The answer seems obvious, so why don't all intelligent

scientists accept this? Michael Behe answers:

Many people, including many important and well-respected

scientists, just don't want there to be anything beyond

nature. They don't want a supernatural being to affect nature,

no matter how brief or constructive the interaction may have

been. In other words, - they bring an a priori philosophical

commitment to their science that restricts what kinds of

explanations they will accept about the physical world.

Sometimes this leads to rather odd behavior.18

The crux of the matter is this: If one accepts there is a God

who created us, then that God also owns us. He thus has a

right to set the rules by which we must live. In the Bible, He

has revealed to us that we are in rebellion against our

Creator.

Because of this rebellion called sin, our physical bodies are

sentenced to death, but we will live on, either with

God, or without Him in a place of judgment.

But the good news is that our Creator provided, through

the cross of Jesus Christ, a means of deliverance for our sin

of rebellion, so that those who come to Him in faith, in

repentance for their sin, can receive the forgiveness of a

Holy God and spend forever with their Lord.

So who created God?

By definition, an infinite, eternal being has always existed

- no one created God. He is the self-existing one, the great

"I am" of the Bible.19

He is outside of time - in fact, He created time.

You might say, "But that means I have to accept this by faith,

as I can't understand it."

We read in the book of Hebrews, But without faith it is

impossible to please him: for he that cometh to God must

believe that he is, and that he is a rewarder of them that

diligently seek him (Hebrews 11:6).

But this is not blind faith, as some think. In fact, the

evolutionists who deny God have a blind faith - they have to

believe something that is against real science, namely, that

information can arise from disorder by chance.

The Christian faith is not a blind faith, it is a logically

defensible faith. This is why the Bible makes it clear that

anyone who does not believe in God is without excuse:

For the invisible things of him from the creation of the world

are clearly seen, being understood by the things that are

made, even his eternal power and Godhead; so that they are

without excuse. (Romans 1:20).
Because ,FAITH is the substance of things not seen. Do u see air?? No but you could feel it there for you know it's there so if you have Christ in your life you will know He is there.
It doesn't matter how much proof there is. Those of us who believe believe. We don't need any more proof. Those who do not believe will not believe no matter what they see. Either you have faith and believe or you don't. But faith comes from God. If you want it, ask Him for it. Beyond that no amount of proof will do.
-Many various people say they have THOUGHTS

But those same people can only describe their thoughts, explain them, write them out, they cannot take the thought out of their head and put it on the table for others to touch or see. We can chart brainwaves, we call that proof, but I still haven't seen someones thought on a table anywhere. We can also chart the difference in the brainwave of someone who is praying and someone who is commiting a crime. So why do we say there is proof this person is a murderer by the messages in his brain, but deny the changes in the brain when religion is invoked?

It is a conceited and naive people who think our technology is as advanced as it will EVER be and we will never create something can can test and measure things that are not on our physical plane of existence.

Besides why would God come to prove anything to us, when all the skeptics would just say it was fake, it was magic tricks, they wouldn't believe with physical proof any more than they do now.

Someone told you that all the history books you read in school were real. You believed THAT? Some website, or some person told you God was not real. You believed it just because it was said? I can feel love, I can explain it, but I can't take the feeling out and let people touch it - does that mean love doesn't exist? So love, thoughts and God are all unreal, because we have no physical evidence of any of them?
Yeah, why doesn't it just clear it all up and show up if it can do anything at all and nothing is greater then it...
thing is that there is so much sin in this world that He can't be with us on this earth yes God can cast out sin but it would be better off cause if He can down the earth his power would be so strong that we could die
Because - a lot of people can stare proof right in the face and they make excuses and have 15 reasons why it could have been something else. God shows himself all the time - you just have to know that it is God and stop trying to make up excuses as to why it isn't. If the disciples were anyting like the people today, they could have been staring at it and made excuses too. Said it was magic, or my favorite - your mind channeled it or the sick person wanted to be healed bad enough that they healed themselves. But the difference is - the disciples believed and didn't make the excuses like you hear today.

Let me tell you a story - My mom HAD (past tense ) M.S. when I was young. She was dying and the Dr. was going to put her in an old folks home to die - all the test proved it - they did it over and over. She couldn't walk, talk, feed herself or anything. The same night that they decided they would put her in the nursing home to die, my dad and my moms best friend came to get her and took her to a revival going on at our church. At the end, they had an alter call and my dad picked her up carried her down and set her on the alter - She got prayed for by the preacher and immediately she stood up and ran around the church and could talk and run and everything - They went back to the hospital and the Dr couldn't believe it and he ran the same tests that he had just done and everything came back normal. Completely normal. Now 30 years later - she has NEVER had another symptom or problem caused by the MS.

Now that was a miracle.

I have heard many non-believers make excuses why it wasn't - dumb things like she healed herself because she wanted it bad enough, her mind did it, the Dr's were wrong -etc. I have heard it all, but let me tell you - Maybe you can "heal " yourself, but not in 5 min. You can not go from death not being able to do anything for yourself to 5 min. later running around the church and yelling. Many people witnesswed it and it changed lives and people still talk about it. So say what you want - but he does still work miracles and show himself to be real - you just have to stop making excuses as to why it isn't what it is.
Because God showing us indisputable truth to stop all this war would be like a parent intervening AGAIN in her child's life to keep the baddies away. How is the child supposed to be an adult that way?
Well, my brother to answer your question you are going to have to humbly take what is given. First of all proof God exists is existence itself. If all this stuff came into being then their source must also exist. This source we call God. This proof was CLEARLY given to us in Jesus Christ. He is the indisputable proof since before history as He says, "Before Abraham, I AM."

God does not need to do any repeat performances. He is God, to repeat Himself is to prove He is not God. And since the bible is the testimony to this proof of God existence, then it is a credible source and cannot be discarded.

God would not reveal Himself in flesh again (born as Jesus again) because that would be a repeat perfomance. And God does reveal His presence everyday. However, God cannot be captured or explained by any human means (e.g.) science, philosophy, psychology, mathematics, etc. etc. because He is beyond all that.

Jesus performed the many miracles to reveal Himself as the Messiah and Son of God. It was proof for them at that time. The proof these miracles happened still exists through apostolic

witnesses. Since they are the ones who walked, ate, and drank with Him then what current proof do I need of God. They said it happened and assured future generations that they did not follow cleverly devised myths (2 Peter 1:16). What was witnessed happend and they ask us to believe it as well.

May the Lord bless and keep you. May He let the light of His face shine upon you.

God's and your beast of burden

Fr. john
Sounds like you have all the proof you need and have already decided.

The point is God could choose to show and prove His existance but then what......a bunch a people who still doubt His existance.... Logical reasoning says alot of things but it's really not about logic. God wants people to find Him for themselves and to choose Him on faith. Jesus Christ did all those miracles and there were many who still doubted His divinity. Heck they crucified Him because of unbelief. So what makes you think that if God was to appear today that you would believe in His existance anymore then you do now.

Faith..........

6 And now, I, Moroni, would speak somewhat concerning these things; I would show unto the world that faith is things which are hoped for and not seen; wherefore, dispute not because ye see not, for ye receive no witness until after the trial of your faith.

7 For it was by faith that Christ showed himself unto our fathers, after he had risen from the dead; and he showed not himself unto them until after they had faith in him; wherefore, it must needs be that some had faith in him, for he showed himself not unto the world.

8 But because of the faith of men he has shown himself unto the world, and glorified the name of the Father, and prepared a way that thereby others might be partakers of the heavenly gift, that they might hope for those things which they have not seen.

9 Wherefore, ye may also have hope, and be partakers of the gift, if ye will but have faith.

10 Behold it was by faith that they of old were called after the holy order of God.

11 Wherefore, by faith was the law of Moses given. But in the gift of his Son hath God prepared a more excellent way; and it is by faith that it hath been fulfilled.

12 For if there be no faith among the children of men God can do no miracle among them; wherefore, he showed not himself until after their faith.

They may just be Holy Books but there are things to be learned nevertheless. This passage answers why it doesn't happen the way you wish it would, and it all has to deal with exercising your faith. If you have no faith it isn't going to happen.

Here is an interesting article

Subject: Fw: Theory of Evil

"Does evil exist? Did God create evil?"

The University professor challenged his students with this question:

"Did God create everything that exists?"

A student bravely replied, "Yes he did!"

"God created everything?" The professor asked.

"Yes sir", the student replied.

The professor answered, "If God created everything, then God

created evil, since evil exists, and according to the principal that

our works define who we are, then God is evil."

The student became quiet before such an answer. The professor,

quite pleased with himself, boasted to the students that he had proven

once more that the religious faith was a myth.

Another student raised his hand and said, "Can I ask you a

question professor?"

"Of course", replied the professor.

The student stood up and asked, "Professor does cold exist?"

"What kind of question is this? Of course it exists. Have you

never been cold?" The students snickered at the young man's

question.

The young man replied, "In fact sir, cold does not exist.

According to the laws of physics, what we consider cold is in

reality the absence of heat. Everybody or object is susceptible

to study when it has or transmits energy, and heat is what makes

a body or matter have or transmit energy.

Absolute zero (-460? F) is the total absence of heat; all

matter becomes inert and incapable of reaction at that temperature.

Cold does not exist. We have created this word to describe how

we feel if we have no heat."

The student continued, "Professor, does darkness exist?"

The professor responded, "Of course it does."

The student replied, "Once again you are wrong sir, darkness

does not exist either. Darkness is in reality the absence of light. Light

we can study, but not darkness. In fact we can use Newton's prism

to break white light into many colors and study the various wavelengths

of each color. You cannot measure darkness. A simple ray of light can

break into a world of darkness and illuminate it. How can you know

how dark a certain space is? You measure the amount of light present.

Isn't this correct? Darkness is a term used by man to describe what

happens when there is no light present."

Finally the young man asked the professor, "Sir, does evil exist?"

Now uncertain, the professor responded, "Of course as I have

already said. We see it everyday. It is in the daily example of man's

inhumanity to man. It is in the multitude of crime and violence

everywhere in the world. These manifestations are nothing else but evil.

To this the student replied, "Evil does not exist sir, or at least

it does not exist unto itself. Evil is simply the absence of God. It is

just like darkness and cold, a word that man has created to describe

the absence of God. God did not create evil. Evil is the result of what

happens when man does not have God's love present in his heart. It's

like the cold that comes when there is no heat or the darkness that

comes when there is no light."

The professor sat down.

The young man's name -- Albert Einstein
Bravo suspendor! Very well answered. Ditto on all points.
That will be negating the exact purpose of creation of this world. Of course if God wanted us just to believe in him he can obviously do it one way or another. But we human beings are given free will and sent to live in this world so that we can prove ourselves to be honest and truthfull. And your asking for clear proof might just be termed as: someone is always asking for more proof. The proofs are here but you have to put some effort in finding them, contemple, and look for them sincerely. God rewards for efforts, don't expect yourself to be spoon-fed by Him in this life as this life is a testing place. If God just "shows" you some irrefutable proof how will your willingness to find the truth is to be cheked. Also if some logic seems ok to you it doesn't necessarily means to be correct. And if and omnipotent being exists then He must know more about the intrication of human physocolgy and how best to test them. Don't question why He has not given "clearer" proof. Question that if He has given a stisfactory proof or not. And look for it. Here is something that contains a proof of God's existance.

http://www.muhammad.net/quran/amazingQur...